nolim_12 Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Request Information Name: [N.L.A] nolim_12 Offender-Name: [sC] Waag Date: 2015-02-12 22:24 (GMT+1) Reason: RDM, no prior engagement other than what's shown in the video. luckiiee and A. Savage 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 why post a ban request on someone you are in a house to kill, kills you? i am pretty sure that if he haden`t killed you, you would have killed him. Dear Vindim, i'm glad to see that you are concerned about the topic regarding my ban request. First off i would like to point out that breaking server rules isn't something that’s appreciated by me or most of the players - no matter who's killing who. Most of the players try to work by the corresponding rules and are trying to keep the server clean and fair. To do this we need to report when players misbehave. The difference between how I would have handled the situation and how this situation was handled is that I would have ROLE PLAYED! I’m also afraid that the argument you are presenting is based on argumentum ad ignorantiam (that’s latin for “Argument from ignorance”) which means assuming that a claim is true because it has not been or cannot be proven false, or vice versa. I would suggest you to do some reading on the subject since it can be quite harmful to your future conclusions to not have insight in the subject. Read more about argument from ignorance (and other logical fallacies) at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance Best regards nolim_12 VisionPie and Ferm 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 I told you to not go in, you went inside pointing a weapon in my face which didnt feel too safe, and I knew you were there to kill/kidnap/rob me since you were like 5+ people going in to the house I were in.. how can you take this as RDM ? I had my cause too kill you, you could have yelled something before going in pointing your gun in my face, and then we would have a situation, you should also turn your VON higher because I yelled at you when you entered the house to not come in, sure I could have gave you a choice for example " Do not come in otherwise i will shoot you" etc, that part is true. but use common sense ! I dont know how you found me there but no matter how you knew I had a gun, and both you and I knows that NLA and SC is not getting along as we have killed some of your members etc etc. so it was pretty obvious that you would do something against me. Paatero and Uggmull 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 I were maybe a bit hard/fast on the trigger but with you standing with a gun there + your mates just behind you I saw no other way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Okay, so this is what happened, me and my friend and gang member [sC] R. Karlsson is taking out gear at his house in Zaros, suddenly he drops down dead because of a random bugg, I pick his TRG with silencer and MRCO scope and goes out from his house, then I see a chopper with NLA in, they are flying around and I try to hide, I thought they spotted me so I ran to a random house and lay there with commander view to look around the house because I knew NLA were landing their choppers, then I see Khedaffi Umar and Nolim from NLA, when they Nolim has reached the second floor I yell " Stick ut ! stick ut! stick ut! " I know that he speaks swedish so I only said it in swedish, he doesnt follow my orders and runs into the room where I am in with a raised gun, of reaction I starts to shoot at him to defend me since I warned him and he went inside anyways,as Vindm said, if I wouldnt kill him as I did there then he would have killed me. which they later did. I dont know if it was server error or if it was his / mine audio that fucked up, because in his video you hear me yell when he is right infront of me, therefore his POV seems like lack of RP / RDM, my video in other hand, you can clearly hear me yell at him in good time. as I said before, ( I think :c ) I did do wrong, I didnt gave him a " choice" but as I said, he knew that I knew what they were planning, you can hear in his video, one of them says, ( He is commander ) so they knew that I knew they ran into the building. my POV : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ME-kVF8dDU&feature=youtu.be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 When I said " Stick ut ! Stick ut ! " what did you believe would be the consequenses if you didnt listen to me ? " stick ut! / Get out ! or.... you'll get a hug ? comeon.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckiiee Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 His Gun is not raised, u didnt give him a choise and u killed him after two secs even though he was going for the stairs which by the way is the only way out (and that was what u wanted right). I was there so i was a witness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 well I knew that if he runs down the stairs, or whatever, and if I have failed to kill him, they wont leave me there.. it would just earn them time to heal up etc, the trigger was pulled, damaged already done. Yes I agree to the fact that I didn't give him a choice, had no time, if my voice in game would have reached him before he ran into the room we would be able to talk, unfortunately my voice reached him too late, and I could never know that there was a "delay" without seeing his video, so that explains why he didnt stopped in the room next to mine when I yelled, and since I told him to get out of there, and he ran in, I shot by reaction, as I said, when the first bullet was shot, there was no going back. But yes, I agree I did wrong by not giving him a choice, as I said since he ran inside so quickly and my voice "lagged // had delay" I didnt had time to advance my sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckiiee Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Okey then I don't know what the discussion is about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPSgamer Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Över alla gånger som SC har rdmat så var denna inte en utav gångarna, jag är ganska säker på att varenda person på servern skulle ha fått en liknande reaktion som denna, om ni ser på Waags perspektiv så ser ni att han sa "Stick" 2 - 3 sekunder innan ni kom upp medans inom Nolims perspektiv så säger han det samtidigt som han ser honom. Jag antar att "Waag" ej var medveten om att voice chat har en delay på runt 2 till 3 sekunder så när han trodde att han hade varnat er innan ni han reagera på det samtidigt som ni kom in i samma rum som honom. Iallafall, inom ett neutralt perspektivt så tycker jag att han ej förtjänar ban för detta med tanke på att i 9 fall av 10 så skulle "Waag" bli nersprayad om han nu inte skulle ha skutit tillbaks i självförsvar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckiiee Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Det finns en anledning varför man ska vänta ett par sekunder mer och det är pga ev von delay! Och ur ren rp synpunkt kan man inte meja ner någon för att man antar att man ska bli dödad, annars kan man använda det argumentet hejvilt i varje situation, finns en anledning varför man måste rp:a innan man dödar någon. Sen vet jag inte om du sett dom nya reglerna som säger att man enbart får kommentera ban requests som man själv är involverad i eller vittne till. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckiiee Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Även ur Waag:s POV så är det enbart 2-3 sekunder efter han säger "stick ut" som han börjar skjuta vilket är för lite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Jag antog att han hörde mig, menh sprang in ändå, så jag sköt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br0ze Posted February 14, 2015 Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 The commander is strong in this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V1RRE Posted February 14, 2015 Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 The commander is strong in this one Ofcourse =) Br0ze 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 I told you to not go in, you went inside pointing a weapon in my face which didnt feel too safe, and I knew you were there to kill/kidnap/rob me since you were like 5+ people going in to the house I were in.. how can you take this as RDM ? I had my cause too kill you, you could have yelled something before going in pointing your gun in my face, and then we would have a situation, you should also turn your VON higher because I yelled at you when you entered the house to not come in, sure I could have gave you a choice for example " Do not come in otherwise i will shoot you" etc, that part is true. but use common sense ! I dont know how you found me there but no matter how you knew I had a gun, and both you and I knows that NLA and SC is not getting along as we have killed some of your members etc etc. so it was pretty obvious that you would do something against me. Okey, lets debunk this argumentation: “I told you to not go in” – False, if you don’t remember what you said, please have a look at the video “you went inside pointing a weapon in my face which didnt feel too safe” - Please refer to the rule stating that you’re allowed to open fire if somebody points a gun at you “and I knew you were there to kill/kidnap/rob me since you were like 5+ people going in to the house I were in..” - The argument you are presenting is based on argumentum ad ignorantiam (that’s latin for “Argument from ignorance”) which means assuming that a claim is true because it has not been or cannot be proven false, or vice versa “how can you take this as RDM ?” - Well, how about the fact that you DIDEN’T ROLEPLAY?! “I had my cause too kill you, you could have yelled something before going in pointing your gun in my face, and then we would have a situation, you should also turn your VON higher because I yelled at you when you entered the house to not come in” - Well it would be useful if you provided a proof for this, my VON is/was at max, and we were two ppl in place, none of us heard you, thank you. “sure I could have gave you a choice for example " Do not come in otherwise i will shoot you" etc, that part is true. but use common sense !” - That would have been great since it’s a rule to do it.. but hey, I would have settled for hands up or equivalent “I dont know how you found me there but no matter how you knew I had a gun, and both you and I knows that NLA and SC is not getting along as we have killed some of your members etc etc. so it was pretty obvious that you would do something against me.” - Yes, we found you. That doesn’t mean you have KoS. (don't mention the war ) - The rest of your arguments is based on "argumentum ad ignorantiam". (you can read above what that means) 1 done 6 to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 I were maybe a bit hard/fast on the trigger but with you standing with a gun there + your mates just behind you I saw no other way. Well, "stick ut" isen't the best way to tell somebody youre about to open fire. As mentioned in the post above, pointing a gun can't be seen as KoS. 2 done 5 to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Okay, so this is what happened, me and my friend and gang member [sC] R. Karlsson is taking out gear at his house in Zaros, suddenly he drops down dead because of a random bugg, I pick his TRG with silencer and MRCO scope and goes out from his house, then I see a chopper with NLA in, they are flying around and I try to hide, I thought they spotted me so I ran to a random house and lay there with commander view to look around the house because I knew NLA were landing their choppers, then I see Khedaffi Umar and Nolim from NLA, when they Nolim has reached the second floor I yell " Stick ut ! stick ut! stick ut! " I know that he speaks swedish so I only said it in swedish, he doesnt follow my orders and runs into the room where I am in with a raised gun, of reaction I starts to shoot at him to defend me since I warned him and he went inside anyways,as Vindm said, if I wouldnt kill him as I did there then he would have killed me. which they later did. I dont know if it was server error or if it was his / mine audio that fucked up, because in his video you hear me yell when he is right infront of me, therefore his POV seems like lack of RP / RDM, my video in other hand, you can clearly hear me yell at him in good time. as I said before, ( I think :c ) I did do wrong, I didnt gave him a " choice" but as I said, he knew that I knew what they were planning, you can hear in his video, one of them says, ( He is commander ) so they knew that I knew they ran into the building. “Okay, so this is what happened, me and my friend and gang member [sC] R. Karlsson is taking out gear at his house in Zaros, suddenly he drops down dead because of a random bugg, I pick his TRG with silencer and MRCO scope and goes out from his house, then I see a chopper with NLA in, they are flying around and I try to hide, I thought they spotted me so I ran to a random house and lay there with commander view to look around the house because I knew NLA were landing their choppers, then I see Khedaffi Umar and Nolim from NLA, when they Nolim has reached the second floor I yell " Stick ut ! stick ut! stick ut! " I know that he speaks swedish so I only said it in Swedish” - Agree “he doesnt follow my orders and runs into the room where I am in with a raised gun, of reaction I starts to shoot at him to defend me since I warned him and he went inside anyways” - False, as you can see in the video I’m backing of and heeding against the stairs. “as Vindm said, if I wouldnt kill him as I did there then he would have killed me. which they later did. I dont know if it was server error or if it was his / mine audio that fucked up, because in his video you hear me yell when he is right infront of me, therefore his POV seems like lack of RP / RDM, my video in other hand, you can clearly hear me yell at him in good time. “ - Read my comment above on Vindm’s post. - On your own video there is 1 seconds and 57 hundredths between you start to yell and when you open fire. Are you sure that this would count as “in good time”? “as I said before, ( I think :c ) I did do wrong, I didnt gave him a " choice" but as I said, he knew that I knew what they were planning, you can hear in his video, one of them says, ( He is commander ) so they knew that I knew they ran into the building.” - Well, so we’re back to argument from ignorance! How could you possible know what we were about to do?! (And yes, you saw us run in to the house) 3 done 4 to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Över alla gånger som SC har rdmat så var denna inte en utav gångarna, jag är ganska säker på att varenda person på servern skulle ha fått en liknande reaktion som denna, om ni ser på Waags perspektiv så ser ni att han sa "Stick" 2 - 3 sekunder innan ni kom upp medans inom Nolims perspektiv så säger han det samtidigt som han ser honom. Jag antar att "Waag" ej var medveten om att voice chat har en delay på runt 2 till 3 sekunder så när han trodde att han hade varnat er innan ni han reagera på det samtidigt som ni kom in i samma rum som honom. Iallafall, inom ett neutralt perspektivt så tycker jag att han ej förtjänar ban för detta med tanke på att i 9 fall av 10 så skulle "Waag" bli nersprayad om han nu inte skulle ha skutit tillbaks i självförsvar. Aiit, let's beak this down as well. ”Över alla gånger som SC har rdmat så var denna inte en utav gångarna, jag är ganska säker på att varenda person på servern skulle ha fått en liknande reaktion som denna, om ni ser på Waags perspektiv så ser ni att han sa "Stick" 2 - 3 sekunder innan ni kom upp medans inom Nolims perspektiv så säger han det samtidigt som han ser honom.” - Other RDMs has little to do with this case. - It sure isn’t 3 sec, please try to clock it again. (and yes, I’m referring to Waag’s own video) ”Jag antar att "Waag" ej var medveten om att voice chat har en delay på runt 2 till 3 sekunder så när han trodde att han hade varnat er innan ni han reagera på det samtidigt som ni kom in i samma rum som honom.” - Interesting, what are you basing this assumption on? ”Iallafall, inom ett neutralt perspektivt så tycker jag att han ej förtjänar ban för detta” - Don’t really know what makes you neutral and your opinion doesn’t really make a difference, thank you. ” med tanke på att i 9 fall av 10 så skulle "Waag" bli nersprayad om han nu inte skulle ha skutit tillbaks i självförsvar.” - And we’re back to ignorance. (edit: Self-defence? Shooting back? - Have you even seen the videos?) Best regard, nolim_12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 When I said " Stick ut ! Stick ut ! " what did you believe would be the consequenses if you didnt listen to me ? " stick ut! / Get out ! or.... you'll get a hug ? comeon.. - Argumentum ad hominem, the evasion of the actual topic by directing an attack at your opponent (nice one!) (Read more at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem) 4 done 3 to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 well I knew that if he runs down the stairs, or whatever, and if I have failed to kill him, they wont leave me there.. it would just earn them time to heal up etc, the trigger was pulled, damaged already done. Yes I agree to the fact that I didn't give him a choice, had no time, if my voice in game would have reached him before he ran into the room we would be able to talk, unfortunately my voice reached him too late, and I could never know that there was a "delay" without seeing his video, so that explains why he didnt stopped in the room next to mine when I yelled, and since I told him to get out of there, and he ran in, I shot by reaction, as I said, when the first bullet was shot, there was no going back. But yes, I agree I did wrong by not giving him a choice, as I said since he ran inside so quickly and my voice "lagged // had delay" I didnt had time to advance my sentence. “well I knew that if he runs down the stairs, or whatever, and if I have failed to kill him, they wont leave me there.. it would just earn them time to heal up etc, the trigger was pulled, damaged already done. Yes I agree to the fact that I didn't give him a choice, had no time, if my voice in game would have reached him before he ran into the room we would be able to talk, unfortunately my voice reached him too late, and I could never know that there was a "delay" without seeing his video, so that explains why he didnt stopped in the room next to mine when I yelled, and since I told him to get out of there, and he ran in, I shot by reaction, as I said, when the first bullet was shot, there was no going back. But yes, I agree I did wrong by not giving him a choice, as I said since he ran inside so quickly and my voice "lagged // had delay" I didnt had time to advance my sentence.” - Delay or not, 1,57 sec is still too little time to react. (based on your own video) 5 done 2 to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Jag antog att han hörde mig, menh sprang in ändå, så jag sköt. - Don´t want to repeat myself, but heeey, check your video, 1,57 sec from first word to first bullet. 6 done 1 to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolim_12 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Ofcourse =) - On this point we stand united, it sure is powerful =) I would also like to add that it would have been much easier to respond to your comments if you had put them in a single post.. 7 done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eurozze Posted February 14, 2015 Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Could any of the parts post a video showing that there was no kind of aggression from any of the parts or if any part actually warned the other? I do need a little more footage to be able to judge this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldo Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 Nolim, did you learn a new latin phrase in school? Looks kinda silly when you use it in every post. From outsider perspective, it looks like you guys were going in looking for a fight. You had him cornered and you outnumbered him, boohoo you got shot. Looks like you were just baiting him to open fire, and frankly regarding how NLA works and treats civs, I can see why shooting would be the only option left for him to get out alive of the situation. If you really wanted to RP (and NLA is known for outstanding RP as we all know) you could have just yelled at him to come out and surrender. Paatero 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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